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Destinova
09-27-2007, 12:42 AM
"Let it be known to Coronach," Father Destinova, the Chamberlain and Vicar of Wessex proclaimed to his messenger, "that an assize has been called. The accused are Caine Kindrid and Spaw Kindrid who will stand before a jury of their peers to be judged of the heinous crime of disrespect and harrassment towards another resident of the Duchy of Wessex."

Destinova broke the Duke's seal on a parchment he had been given by the Duke earlier and unrolled it on his desk. "The following shall attend as jury. Koma, The Hawk, Seeker of Truth, herald to the Duke of Wessex. Aethelric, Clerk of the Ducal Court. Thyreus de Gothia, Sheriff of Wessex. Sayton de Gothia, Man-at-Arms of the Ducal Garrison. Robert Setles, clerk of the Ducal Court. Theodoric Brionne, Footman of the Ducal Garrison."

Pausing to contemplate the events of the day, Destinova shook his head. As he handed the writ to the messenger he said, "See that Coronach is informed, show him this if need be. He needs to contact each member of the jury and inform them to report in at court. Tomorrow we shall present the evidence in front of them. Go now." The messenger left silently.

Caine
09-27-2007, 01:10 AM
Im completly offended and humiliated at the fact that I wasn't saught out at all about anything that happend. Im so sad right now that you are puting me on trial, 8***** -(. This makes me sad so much that you didn't even talk to me about what happend and you just banned me without any type of warning. And you keep sending me ichurch invites and its' hurting my feelings. Its on my rights, I dont want to join in something I dont believe in. Kind of like how I was banned for using a common "word" which is as you know a word. Words physicallyylyly hurt and theres no way I can turn away from the screen.

Oprah
09-27-2007, 01:13 AM
Well most of us were completely offended by your actions today. :(

Spaw Kindred
09-27-2007, 01:15 AM
(( The big main part of this argument would probably come up with the usage of the word, 'gay'. The word 'gay' has been influenced in my daily life for the past eight years, for as long as I can remember as another way to say it being, 'stupid'. I was confronted by him about the usage of the word 'gay', and I told him that, honestly; I wasn't going to change my ways anytime soon for one compliant against a person who beliefs I don't believe in. So why should I have to change my everyday speech because of one anothers beliefs. ))

Sayton Reinhardt
09-27-2007, 11:18 AM
((I have no idea what has happened, but I'm available for the jury duty. I hope we can work whatever it is that happened out in a friendly manner.))

Robert Setles
09-27-2007, 02:19 PM
I humbly remit for jury duty.

Erwin Carius
09-27-2007, 03:49 PM
((Just making it known that I've seen the message that I'm called to jury duty.))

Theodoric Brionne
09-27-2007, 03:58 PM
((I will be on 7pm - 1am EST, and have been notified of my obligation for jury duty.))

Destinova
09-27-2007, 05:58 PM
His boots made an ominous clacking sound on the marbled floor of the grand audience chamber as he approached the evidence table. Destinova's strides were purposeful, but not slow enough to cause anyone to think he was being over-dramatic, which he knew he was.

The evidence table was strewn with paper. Transcripts, he knew. The most difficult part was figuring where to begin. There was such a mess, most of it given to him by several different people. He supposed he'd try to start from before the beginning. Clearing his throat felt good, but didn't help make what he had to say any easier.

"People of the jury, welcome. On this day of our Lady, the twenty-seventh day of this month of September, in the year twenty-hundred and seven, we are gathered to pass judgment on two of our esteemed peers." Destinova glanced at the bench where Caine and Spaw Kindrid were seated. "Caine Kindrid and Spaw Kindrid, you stand accused of breaking the Common Law under the article of 'Let no one molest or harass his fellow subject.'

"Before the evidence is shown, I must remind you all that as a jury you are obligated to judge without bias. Previous friendships or animosities are to be set aside. Only the facts Shall be judged here, and let's keep it at this. This is simply the case of one person who felt threatened, intimidated and singled-out by two people who broke the common law of Wessex by doing so. But I'm getting ahead of myself. Let me go back to where I am told it began.

"In the piece below, we see Finnigan enter the room and without provocation is verbally attacked by Spaw."

[21:15] * [WSX]Finnigan has joined #wsx
[21:15] <[WSX]Finnigan> Afternoon, all.
[21:16] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Hey.
[21:16] <[WSX]Finnigan> How'd the drill go yesturday?
[21:16] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Had server problems.
[21:16] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Didn't happen to my knowledge.
[21:17] <[WSX]Finnigan> No?
[21:17] <[WSX]Finnigan> That's too bad.
[21:17] <[WSX]Finnigan> Maybe we can get one rolling, today, perhaps.
[21:18] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Finnigan was up to nogood, smokin that weed in the neighborhood. He got blimbburned once and his mom gotscared, said your movingwith your auntie and uncle in compton.
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I see a thread called "Release Party"
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> if its about Halo3
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Go fuck y ourself.
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> YEP
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> GO FUCK URSELF
[21:19] <[WSX]Finnigan> What's that?
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Halo3nuuubbbzzzz
[21:19] <[WSX]Finnigan> Can't hear you over the whine.

"This was the first exchange. It doesn't end there however, Spaw continues to direct his hostility at Finnigan after a few short minutes."

[21:22] <[WSX]Finnigan> Who is Jarlaxle anyway?
[21:22] <+[WSX]Chrono> A solo player from rune
[21:23] <+[WSX]Chrono> Or so he say
[21:23] <[WSX]Finnigan> Aside from a person who takes Salvatore too seriously.
[21:23] <+[WSX]Chrono> He said he had no intentions of joining Wsx.
[21:23] <[WSX]Finnigan> So he's just a scrounger?
[21:23] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> scrounger?
[21:23] <+[WSX]Chrono> scrounger?
[21:23] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Hes just another player.
[21:24] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> We ain't no "thou thy speech" terms
[21:24] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> hes a regular gamer who owns faces.
[21:24] <+[WSX]Chrono> owns faces?
[21:24] <[WSX]Finnigan> Woah, calm down ma'am.
[21:24] <+[WSX]Chrono> I think hes from the DF board
[21:24] <+[WSX]Chrono> He know about their server
[21:24] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Ma'am?
[21:25] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Don't start with name callin' like that Finnigan.
[21:25] <[WSX]Finnigan> Start?
[21:25] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Only Chrono can,<3
[21:25] <+[WSX]Chrono> : O
[21:25] <[WSX]Finnigan> "nuuubbbzzzz"
[21:25] <+[WSX]Chrono> lol
[21:25] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> fag
[21:26] <+[WSX]Chrono> easy now...
[21:26] <[WSX]Finnigan> Woah. Now that's going a little bit too far.
[21:26] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> hey Fnnigian how aoubt you go fcuk yurolesf sptiud siht
[21:26] <+[WSX]Chrono> : O
[21:26] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I love that trick.
[21:27] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> scramble the letters but you can still read it
[21:27] <+[WSX]Chrono> what trick?
[21:27] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> as long as the last and first letter are inplace, youcan read it.
[21:27] <+[WSX]Chrono> yes.. wow.
[21:28] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> btw finnigan if you think my comment wasserious, I guess I gotta slap ya a gewd one.

"When I look at this, I can't find any reason for Spaw to be hostile towards Finnigan. He's a trial member, and as far as I can tell very friendly towards everyone. He's so keen about Wessex, he's taken the yeoman exam already and he's not even a full member. There's absolutely no reason to treat him this way. While I'll agree that Finnigan may or may not have asked him to stop at this point, and perhaps even encouraged him a little bit by engaging him with mock titles, this is not all the evidence I have to present. Let us view the next piece.

"These were given to me as private message logs between Finnigan and Spaw. Much of Finnigan's text is left out."

[14:39] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> If I were to give two shits on a arguement, I wouldn't say that.
[14:40] <[WSX]Finnigan> Then cope with people who refute your ignorance. As a member of the GSA, at my college, I take GREAT offense to derogatory terms that associate those of homosexuality as being anything other than people like you or me.
[14:40] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> ...
[14:40] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Your part of "The Alliance"
[14:40] <[WSX]Finnigan> Gay Straight Alliance, yes.
------------------------------
[14:45] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Its a word, if I'm titled, I can say fuck them because I'm disciplined for it.
[14:45] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I could care less waht they think.
[14:45] <[WSX]Finnigan> Why are you even fighting? Couldn't you just take a step back for a moment and consider the possibility of just respecting your peers through limiting language that offends people?
[14:47] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Well for one, this in the internet, and I like to keep my grasp on the first amendment. But I do understand what your saying, but honestly. It doesn't make a difference unless I care about the person.
----------
[14:58] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I'm clearly thinking. I'm just telling you that, I don't need people, I can be self-sufficent. This is how I work, If I offend you, and if you expect for me to change, you better offer something back.
[14:58] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> If a person wants to change the way I am, they need to change/do something in return.
[14:58] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Me being unique, my identity.
[14:59] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Like you said earlier, stand out.
[14:59] <[WSX]Finnigan> Perhaps you shouldn't be part of a clan, if you are so incapable of thinking of your peers. My vocabulary doesn't harm. Derogatory terms forged from hate, and so over-generalized do.
[15:00] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Only reason why I'm part of the clan is because theres going to be a hell alot of PVP, aswell as ex-DL memembers are in the Duchy. I respect people who I trust and know. If I don't know you/trust you, then I won't change my ways for you.

"All this before Caine even showed up. Between the exchanges, Spaw and Finnigan both quit IRC and returned. At this point, Spaw had not yet returned. Here's what happened when Caine showed up."

[23:14] * Caine has joined #WSX
[23:16] <Caine> *steals car stero*
[23:16] <+[WSX]Chrono> : O
[23:17] <[WSX]Gwar> HEY! put my stereo back caine
[23:17] <Caine> Tea drinking honkeee, plllzzz
[23:18] <[WSX]Gwar> honkee? i prefer white trash, thank you very much
[23:19] * [WSX]Finnigan steals stereo from Caine and wanders off.
[23:21] <Caine> go a head
[23:21] <Caine> be my guest
[23:21] <Caine> little do you know
[23:21] <Caine> that the stero
[23:22] <Caine> is actually an anti-gay basher
[23:22] <[WSX]Finnigan> ...
[23:22] <[WSX]Finnigan> Wow.
[23:22] <[WSX]Finnigan> Caine...

"Seems almost like he had been briefed that Finnigan didn't take kindly to Spaw's use of the word 'gay'. Caine continued on, seemingly having a conversation with himself until he got more responses."

[23:24] <Caine> So lets talk about Welfare, any statements you'd like to make Mr. Jefferson
[23:24] <Caine> *Fat Albert* - I wanna talk toooo!
[23:25] <Caine> Well, lets talk about Poverty
[23:25] <Caine> this is soooooo gay. Df come out... NOW
[23:26] <@[WSX]Coronach> Damn, Caine. Sounds like someone jacked your account.
[23:27] <Caine> Im pissed off actually
[23:27] <Caine> and im letting it off by typing
[23:27] <Caine> I fucking hate people
[23:27] <Caine> they need to die
[23:27] <Caine> they all need to die
[23:27] <Caine> in horrible car crashes
[23:27] <+[WSX]Chrono> : O
[23:27] <@[WSX]Coronach> Okay.
[23:27] <+[WSX]Chrono> ........
[23:28] <[WSX]Gwar> strange
[23:28] <Caine> Really?
[23:29] <Caine> if you don't know
[23:29] <Caine> the answer
[23:29] <Caine> to that
[23:29] <Caine> then you have never worked
[23:29] <Caine> with people
[23:29] <Caine> ina resturaunt
[23:29] <Caine> or retail
[23:29] <[WSX]Gwar> oh i have, trust me

"At this point, Spaw returns. They talk about nothing relevant for a bit. Setles, Coronach and Chrono join in the conversation. A bit later this begins..."

[23:41] <Caine> Now i need to write a paper on gay people
[23:41] <Caine> does anyone know anything about "gay" people
[23:41] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> :o
[23:41] <[WSX]Finnigan> omg...
[23:41] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> lol.
[23:42] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I know gay actions happenalot in prison
[23:42] <Caine> this i so gay
[23:42] <Caine> that i have to write
[23:42] <Caine> a gay paper
[23:42] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> you seem to be really gay today Caine.
[23:42] <Caine> dude there was this gay person at work today
[23:42] <Caine> yeah i know
[23:42] <Caine> or do they
[23:42] <Caine> have u ever looked
[23:42] <Caine> perv
[23:42] <[WSX]Setles> unless you are reffering to it as a happy gay
[23:43] <Caine> no such thing
[23:43] <Caine> wait
[23:43] <Caine> gay-aids
[23:43] <Caine> similairty
[23:43] <Caine> The American Psychological Association did a study on two gay indiviuals
[23:43] <Caine> apparently they had un-protected sex for many many years
[23:44] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Did they fail to be able to raise children like in South Park?
[23:44] <Caine> did not recieve any problems with their.. yeah..
[23:44] <Caine> Also did you know that the word gay means a lot of things
[23:44] <Caine> like stupid
[23:44] <Caine> ugly
[23:44] <Caine> lame
[23:44] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> eww..meatspin justpoppedup in my head.
[23:44] <Caine> usually just poop
[23:44] <Caine> unless the ground could talk
[23:44] <Caine> like plants
[23:44] <Caine> for fertalizer
[23:45] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Plants can talk.
[23:45] <Caine> then they would cal it happy poop
[23:45] <Caine> NOT ENGRISH
[23:45] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Caine lets do the Duchy Dance! YOu too Chrono!
[23:45] * [WSX]SpawKindrid dances in the middle of the arena
[23:45] <+[WSX]Chrono> wasdwasdswadwadswadawdasdawdasdawd
[23:45] <Caine> Did you know that there is statistical evidence that people in the GSA have wussys
[23:45] <+[WSX]Chrono> dawdsadawdasdawdsdwaasdawdasdawdasdaw
[23:45] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> wdwadawdawdsdwasdwas
[23:45] <+[WSX]Chrono> awdasdawdasdawdasdawdasdawdawdasdawd
[23:45] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> dwadsdwasdwaswasdwa
[23:45] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> wasdwasdwadssdwadasda
[23:45] <Caine> and cant even protect themselves
[23:45] <Caine> so they form a gang
[23:46] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> A Gay math teacher at our school runs the "Alliance"
[23:46] <Caine> wow
[23:46] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> his name is Mr. Patrick
[23:46] <Caine> is he the dance teacher as well
[23:46] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> lol
[23:46] <[WSX]Finnigan> Stop it!
[23:47] <Caine> GAY GAY GAY GAY GAY GAY GAY
[23:47] <[WSX]Finnigan> Right bloody now. What is wrong with you two?!
[23:47] <Caine> Bloody?
[23:47] <Caine> have you ever seen blood
[23:47] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Um? Nothing? Besides that i'm hungry.
[23:47] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> And I have Gilberts Syndrome
[23:47] <Caine> im so gay hungry
[23:47] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I found out I was diagnosed with it a while ago.
[23:48] <[WSX]Setles> is gilberts syndrome a nice way of saying you are stupid?
[23:48] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> lol.
[23:48] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> nah. jaundice shit.
[23:48] <Caine> ACCURATE
[23:48] <Caine> HEY FINNIGAN
[23:49] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Finnigan can I have a peice of pie?
[23:49] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> as long as its pumpkin.
[23:49] <[WSX]Finnigan> What do you want?
[23:49] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> as long as its pumpkin.
[23:49] <Caine> I need info on gay people, shit one sec phone

"This is when I looked up and saw what was going on and gave them a timeout from the channel. But it didn't end there, Spaw continued his assault in PM to Finnigan."

[16:55] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> As you can see Finnigan. I can be your friend or I can be your worse enemey. I would've apologized for saying all that, but then I got offended earlier and so then I carried on.
[16:56] <[WSX]Finnigan> you have been banned by your peers on the irc... and attacked me with Caine.
[16:56] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> The funny thing is, Caine is part of the GSTB Alliance, but he still says all that.
[16:56] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Attacked?
[16:56] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> We didn't attack.
[16:56] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> And not by my peers.
[16:56] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I was banned by an asshole that not even most like.
[16:57] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Being banned by Desti is an accomplishment.

"So let's review what's been shown here today.

- Spaw begins his tirade of hostility towards Finnigan arbitrarily.
- Finnigan messages Spaw asking him to stop, Spaw responds that he doesn't think he should. Finnigan declares to Spaw exactly what he has done to offend him. Spaw declares that only people he has known for a long time are worthy of him watching what he says.
- Caine arrives in the channel and begins acting similarly towards Finnigan.
- Spaw and Caine begin a clear assault on Finnigan, based on what Finnigan described as having found offensive.

"Given the logs I've shown you, there's really no disputing their innocence. Although I think their guilt is clinched by their posts in this thread.

"Caine makes a mockery of the events by taking a Zappa type approach to justify his behavior. This to me is an admission of guilt, else why would he attempt to justify himself? Spaw's post is also an attempt to justify his poor behavior.

"They have broken the common law of Wessex. It is written that 'Let no one molest or harass his fellow subject.' Is this not exactly what they have done? He asked Spaw to stop several times and instead of continuing he took it to the next level and brought a friend in to help him!

"It's rather disappointing that two members of Wessex would act so disrespectfully towards another, be it a trial member or not. How can we stand proud together when we allow this type of behavior to occur? It is a disgusting display of aggression I witnessed yesterday and share with you today.

"May the Duke's justice be swift and fair."

Spaw Kindred
09-27-2007, 07:22 PM
(( Just an fyi, I do indeed plead guilty, but I plead guilty with a reasoning.

[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I see a thread called "Release Party"
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> if its about Halo3
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Go fuck y ourself.
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> YEP
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> GO FUCK URSELF
[21:19] <[WSX]Finnigan> What's that?
[21:19] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Halo3nuuubbbzzzz

Was a response to my hatred for Halo3/Consel Games; nothing serious.

21:24] <[WSX]Finnigan> Woah, calm down ma'am.
[21:24] <+[WSX]Chrono> I think hes from the DF board
[21:24] <+[WSX]Chrono> He know about their server
[21:24] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Ma'am?
[21:25] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Don't start with name callin' like that Finnigan.
[21:25] <[WSX]Finnigan> Start?
[21:25] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Only Chrono can,<3
[21:25] <+[WSX]Chrono> : O
[21:25] <[WSX]Finnigan> "nuuubbbzzzz"
[21:25] <+[WSX]Chrono> lol
[21:25] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> fag - didn't know about the whole gay/fag useage at the moment.
[21:26] <+[WSX]Chrono> easy now...
[21:26] <[WSX]Finnigan> Woah. Now that's going a little bit too far.
[21:26] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> hey Fnnigian how aoubt you go fcuk yurolesf sptiud siht

After being called a 'ma'am', I remembered what I learned from school in intro to psych about how the human mind doesn't read all the letters in a word and tested it out, not harm intended there. These logs are like, a coupl'a days old, or some of them are.

[ [21:28] <[WSX]SpawKindrid> btw finnigan if you think my comment was serious, I guess I gotta slap ya a gewd one. ] ))



Spaw standing in front of the crowd and jury. Showing no facial expression awaiting his punishment instead of having to go through the hassle of a trial. Looking at the Chamberlain as he speaks.

Destinova
09-27-2007, 07:29 PM
"Let it be known that not only does Spaw have no regard for the Common Law, but he has no remorse or regret for having broken it. I would like to add this to the evidence."

-13:16:03- <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Desti, if you want me out of the guild, THAT badly. Just say it. I'll quit.
-13:16:05- <[WSX]SpawKindrid> lol.
-13:16:30- <Destinova|AFK> I'd prefer if you just behaved yourself.
-13:17:52- <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Nah Desti, I know you want me kicked from Wessex.
-13:17:56- <[WSX]SpawKindrid> Am I right?
-13:18:09- <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I'm that annoying 12 year old in the CS Pub server where you had the chance with admin, you'd ban in aheart beat.
-13:18:16- <Destinova|AFK> No, I would really just prefer it if you could behave.
-13:18:47- <[WSX]SpawKindrid> But honestly, this thread, doesn't mean shit to me. I'm sorry to say that. If you think this thread is going to change my ways, it isn't. As for behaving myself, yeah. I suppose I can work on it.
-13:22:23- <Destinova|AFK> I don't understand what you're saying.
-13:24:49- <[WSX]SpawKindrid> I'm saying that, if you think this thread/trial makes a big deal to me. It honestly doesn't. I'm might try change my ways of how I've been influenced for sometime now, but you will probably hardly see the difference with the usage of the word 'gay/fag'.
-13:26:32- <[WSX]SpawKindrid> If the thread is to try and humiliate me to other Duchy/DF memembers, its not going to work because I wouldn't care what they think.

Spaw Kindred
09-27-2007, 07:31 PM
This is correct. This log took place about 5 minutes ago. I said what I said and I will stand by it. Let the punishment be sentenced. If I hurt Finnigan's feelings, thats just too bad I suppose. I've been verbally attacked by yourself too Destinova, don't hear me complaining.

As for caring for Common Laws, Yeah I do. But in this case, I don't. For such a small thing that isn't even a big deal which has been totally blown out of proportion.

If I wanted to join a G-Rated Clan/Guild like my Siblings and Dad do for Day of Defeat, I would've all ready. Which gladly I haven't and never will.

Manus Dei
09-27-2007, 10:02 PM
In the future, these trials need to be conducted by sheriffs who decide which evidence is admissable and prevent the trial from becoming a personal issue. In the absence of a presiding sheriff, I will step in now to preside over the remainder of the trial.

The purpose of calling 6 other Wessex members to be jurors is so that the sense of following the gaming clan rules is something enforced and held accountable by players of the same rank as oneself rather than what may appear to be arbitrary punishments handed out by guild leadership. Also, the chance to let many vote on whether someone did in fact break the clan rules helps rule out the possibility of someone being singled out for personal reasons by one high ranking member.

I'm not saying that is what is happening here, and because Destinova is a moderator of our IRC he has some powers like a sheriff. However, since Destinova is taking the role of prosecution in this matter, we're going to need a neutral judge. Because I have a bit too much influence over things, usually it's best if sheriffs do this, as they are also usually freemen and not so highly ranked as cabinet members.

For now though, let us say that the evidence has been presented and the 6 should post their decisions. You are not passing a sentence, only responding on whether you feel the two are guilty or not guilty. If guilty, I shall issue sentencing which will follow the guidelines posted in the Common Law, appropriate to the nature and level of the breech of the rules.

Spaw Kindred
09-27-2007, 10:29 PM
Let this be my closing statement.


In my past online communities, which some of them I'm not proud of being in(myg0t, 4chan, DeathLegion, Face of Mankind, CS/eSports Communities). I was always influenced through the guilds/clans/communities I was in because of them, we didn't have much chat restrictions. Death Legion/FoM Community probably made the biggest impact on this. Being ex-DL member for years, and those inside the Duchy know what I'm talking about. Death Legion/FoM basically harassed each other. It was alright to harass each other 24/7. Sure nobody liked being the target, but it happened anyways; in other words you could've called us savages. But through this new experience which I've never gone through before nor' been called out like this, I now have to realize that the Duchy of Wessex isn't full of people that are savages like my other communities; but people who expect respect in their stay here inside the Duchy. As someone just recently told me, "We don't want word to go around that Wessex treats new members like this, or that people have to put up with that kind of stuff to be part of the clan.
"; which is right. I made an apology to Finnigan last night but he never received it, or saw it in his IRC PM. I figured he blew it off after asking him three times for a response and then I continued my defensive/offensive stance on this matter.
To the jury of the court, I've found myself guilty and know what to do now. Its your decision now.

Erwin Carius
09-27-2007, 10:40 PM
It is my opinion that both defendants are guilty.

Aethelric Brandt
09-27-2007, 11:18 PM
I agree with my fellow juror Thyreus -- both are guilty. I would add, as an aside to the defendants, that I find the crime to rest upon the apparent prolonged harassment, not the exercise of free speech.

Sayton Reinhardt
09-27-2007, 11:18 PM
I find both defendants to be guilty. However I ask Your Grace to take the defendants' reasoning and past into consideration when selecting the punnishment.

((IE. I have seen worse jokes thrown around and yes, this is the Internet after all, even if I don't personally agree with such behaviour.
But I still say guilty because I think that what crossed the line was when Finnegan (to my interpretation) was told that he didn't deserve respect because he is new, as well as the ridiculing following.))

Theodoric Brionne
09-28-2007, 12:23 AM
He stands up before all present and clears his throat, then addresses the audience gathered.

"Proof beyond a reasonable doubt leaves me with an abiding conviction that the charge is true, therefore I find the defendants guilty."

Komako the Hawk
09-28-2007, 12:59 AM
Both defendants; guilty.

Beric Veincrusher
09-28-2007, 01:20 AM
I would raise the question to the Duke whether the jury should be truly compromised of, "peers of the plaintiff and of the defendant." The defendants being Spaw (archer) and Caine (trial member) and the plaintiff being Finnigan (Trial member).

I would seek clarification and justification for the specific choice of jury so that our common law can either be clarified or amended.

Manus Dei
09-28-2007, 04:35 AM
The choice of jury is either gentry or commoners. All called were commoners.

Manus Dei
09-28-2007, 04:47 AM
The sentence I give runs thus:

First, the two are to spend a day in the pillory in the square in front of the Town Gates.

Second, the two are to pay a fine equal to seven days' labor, all of which is to be paid to the ducal coffers. If no further infractions occur between now and that time, this fine shall be reduced to 4 days' labor.

(This means that for the first seven days either of them logs into release Darkfall or beta, 100% of the time must be spent farming for the duchy, with 100% of what is farmed being given. A "day" will constitute at least 4 hour period, but the entire sentence will still need to be done over a four day period. Anything harvested beyond four hours must still be donated to the duchy, and no more than one four hour "day" can be satisfied each 24 hours.)

Surly von Fishbarrel
09-28-2007, 05:19 AM
Question on the sentencing, since I want to be sure it gets enforced when I check with the Sheriff on duty. Assuming there are no further infractions between now and then and the sentence is 4 days, is the following statement correct? The farming period is in effect until both requirements are satisfied: At least 16 full hours of farming have been accounted for and witnessed, and at least 96 hours have passed from the launch of the game servers.

Caine
09-28-2007, 05:47 AM
1. People need to be in ventrilo more for obvious reasons.
2. Some of you have waaaaaaayyyy too much time on your hands.
3. Finnigan knows I was joking
4. Get a mic, come in vent and stop hiding in the "FORMAL" Forums cowards.
5. I'm not going to farm anything for the Duchy in this context.

Manus Dei
09-28-2007, 07:37 AM
Fishbarrel, that's right. At least 96 hours, but at least 4 hours per day.

And Caine, if you don't serve your fine, then you move to the second section of the Common Law. Unpaid fines result in exile. You see, after behaving the way you have been in IRC and in Rune, we need some assurance that you really want to be a part of our group. Farming resources for us is a good way to prove that you really do.

Your choice.

Surly von Fishbarrel
09-28-2007, 08:26 AM
We're not forcing you to farm for the clan, Caine. We're not even asking you to. We're allowing you the opportunity, if you so choose, to make up for your flippant disregard to the rules that we've all agreed to work with. Since the rule you violated isn't all that serious, you're given the luxury of doing something pretty trivial to show us that you didn't break the rules out of disrespect to your fellow teammates. Unless you feel like you deserve special treatment and are above following the rules everyone else does, I don't understand why you'd be against doing a couple of days of farming at the beginning of the game when we're all most likely going to be farming for city-building funds anyway.

You seem to disagree that it's necessary, but without law there is chaos. The Duchy of Wessex stands above all other clans not because of its pretty forum design or theme song, but because we are the only gaming community that has so embraced camaraderie that we have respect of one another enough to have a common law in the first place. It is a contract of mutual respect between all members, as equal parties to the success of the clan.

We don't ask you to understand it, and we certainly don't command you to kowtow to it out of subservience. We merely ask you to respect your fellow clanmates, and therefore, synonymously, our common law. Which includes you.

Manus Dei
09-28-2007, 08:34 AM
Sheriffs, hopefully this gives you some idea of how an "assize" should proceed. Realize that as sheriffs you all have the power to call these assizes whenever you feel it necessary, and the power to issue the sentencing as well.

Now, assizes need not be called very often. Since Wessex started 2 years ago, we have only needed to call two trials - one for people caught trying to drum up support for a guild split/takeover, and one for people harassing new members. Usually, you can simply be a "moderator" by banning people from IRC or censoring forum posts. The reason an assize was called this time was because antagonism was specifically directed at someone for no reason and it was taken to private messages. It should also be considered whether the matter is a personal issue between two who know each other or an issue affecting the success, union and atmosphere of the clan. In this case, the issue set a bad example of how we would like the clan to represent itself to its new members.

In game, when you find someone cluttering up chat channels, simply issue a couple of warnings. Since you cannot moderate guild chat in game, if they fail to heed your warnings, you then may draw up an assize. Of course, all the standard reasons for drawing up assizes still hold, as detailed in the Common Law.

When doing so, please keep the following in mind:

1. You should call 6 people whom you know are active and can post or gather in game quickly to settle the issue.
2. When selecting the 6 to call, consider the defendant's social rank. If the defendant is a freeman or villein, you must call other freemen and villeins. You may only call trials for a defendant esquire rank or below, however, if an esquire is on trial you may call knights and esquires to act as jury. Try to keep it local, though. Don't call a knight from a fief on the other side of Wessex. Also, try not to call close friends of the one pressing charges or friends of the defendant.
3. You may not conduct trials for lords or knights. In the event someone brings charges against someone of this rank, you must inform the Duke or the Chancellor. Also, the clergy handles its own courts, although you may still try friars and deacons yourself.
4. Both sides may appoint a person to speak for them, but do not need to. When they bring forth evidence, you decide what is or is not admissable based on how relevant it is to the issue being charged.
5. When everyone is done presenting their sides, allow the jury to decide the verdict. Once they have, look at the classifications of offenses in the Common Law, and issue a fine or form of "humiliation" which you find appropriate. Use the precedent of cases that have gone before when deciding - Caine and Spaw Kindrid v. Wessex and the sentence of "7 days harvest" for harassing a new recruit is a good start. In the event that what happened was severe enough for you to kick someone out of Wessex, let the Cabinet as well as the person's liege lord know.
6. Set a time or deadline for the sentence to be carried out. Let the clerks as well as the other sheriffs know. Make sure that yourself or another sheriff is there to make sure the sentence is carried out. In the example of the sentence for Kindrids v. Wessex you don't need to follow them around; just check in on them every hour or so and receive their harvest - you'll know if they spent the past hour well.

Caine
09-28-2007, 04:34 PM
Thank you for proving every point I've ever made about how this entire situation is bull-shit. ^_^ Q_Q Exile from something that does'nt exist? From what.. you guys? Heaven forbid I don't get to hang out with you guys. :)

Chrono Veincrusher
09-28-2007, 04:56 PM
I'm sorry to hear that, Caine : /

Coronach
09-28-2007, 05:07 PM
As verdict has been rendered and sentencing passed, this assize may now be adjourned, pending any further formal statements from presiding parties.

Thirlan Tyrandor
09-28-2007, 10:57 PM
Thank you for proving every point I've ever made about how this entire situation is bull-shit. ^_^ Q_Q Exile from something that does'nt exist? From what.. you guys? Heaven forbid I don't get to hang out with you guys. :)

Exile should be quite obvious Caine ^_-
I hope you don't think we're playing fictional kingdoms here? I mean you do know we're waiting for a game called Darkfall? So when that game comes out if you're exiled you don't get to come close to any of the guild cities without being KOS. I mean if you send a pm or a few people chat with you we don't really care. I still get pms from Protonix and from time to time I do chat with him, but for all purposes you wouldn't be in the guild and you wouldn't be treated as a neutral either. So do you understand? If you still don't care then it's fine by us if you go find another guild, but judging from your attitude you probably shouldn't play with a guild since you seem indifferent to everyone else. Necros do tend to be solitary by nature...